Recently appointed elder.
Franklin Massey
JoinedPosts by Franklin Massey
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69
Could ''boredom'' at the Kingdom Hall be one reason why some members leave?
by RULES & REGULATIONS inyou'll find boredom where there is the absence of a good idea earl nightingale quotes (us motivational writer and author, 1921-1989).
let's forget that most members leave due to the wrong beliefs,doctrines and practices of the wts!.
i was bored out of my mind from the repetitive: talks,prayers,ministry school demonstrations,field service talks(peddle magazines),assemblies,special talks and watchtower magazine study articles.
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9
YouTube: A History of God, Part I
by leavingwt in.
"i explain how i learned from a history of god by karen armstrong that the evidence indicates that the jewish concept of monotheism evolved from the syncretism of various polytheistic sources like canaanite and babylonian polytheism.".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlnnwbkmlbg.
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Franklin Massey
I recommend a couple of similar books that shed brilliant light on early religion: Armstrong's Case for God and Robert Wright's The Evolution of God. Both well documented and balanced in their approach.
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69
Could ''boredom'' at the Kingdom Hall be one reason why some members leave?
by RULES & REGULATIONS inyou'll find boredom where there is the absence of a good idea earl nightingale quotes (us motivational writer and author, 1921-1989).
let's forget that most members leave due to the wrong beliefs,doctrines and practices of the wts!.
i was bored out of my mind from the repetitive: talks,prayers,ministry school demonstrations,field service talks(peddle magazines),assemblies,special talks and watchtower magazine study articles.
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Franklin Massey
I agree that the highlights can be the best part of all of the meetings. Sometimes I hear a comment that actually took some thought to prepare, quotes from a secular source *gasp*, or goes way back into older WT literature to present an alternate viewpoint on the material - and I think, "Could that person be 'enlightened' beyond standard WT teachings?" Of course, I never ask. I just commend them for doing extra research and encourage them to keep digging deep so that they can continue to share what they find with their friends.
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3
Rebuttals: Irreducible Complexity
by leavingwt inthe latest video from qualiasoup.
refuting the fallacious criticism put forward against my recent video on irreducible complexity.. .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=as1hlmyeh7q.
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Franklin Massey
If modern day anti-evolutionists, who promote ideas like ID and irreducible complexity, traced those ideas back to where they came from, they would see how evolution works. Ancient stories crawled out of the primitive cultural soup, slowly adapted to their surroundings, underwent a couple of small mutations, and continue to adapt today.
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55
Greetings to All, No Longer Lurking
by Franklin Massey inclaustrophobic.
that's the simplest way for me to express how i feel in the wt org.
like many here, my eyes were slowly opened over the years as i did more earnest research, trying to reconcile some long standing spiritual quandaries.
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Franklin Massey
@yesidid: miseryloveselders has started a compelling and very accurate discussion on the KM school here:
His notes and observations are strikingly similar to mine. These schools are conducted from outlines with very little room for ad-libbing.
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55
Greetings to All, No Longer Lurking
by Franklin Massey inclaustrophobic.
that's the simplest way for me to express how i feel in the wt org.
like many here, my eyes were slowly opened over the years as i did more earnest research, trying to reconcile some long standing spiritual quandaries.
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Franklin Massey
Again, thank you for the welcome messages.
Briefly, on the topic of reform, I see no reform coming. I have no plans of leading the charge. I am growing more and more comfortable with the idea of not having the Society and many of its teachings in my life. Unfortunately, many lovely people have become so dependant on this religion that I fear what their lives would be like if it all came crashing down on them. Some may be too weak to handle the total disintegration of the Org. These are the "Where else would I go?" types who may not have the inner strength to find themselves again. I struggle with the survival-of-the-fittest side of my personality vs. the fatherly nurturing side. For those who are weaker, I would rather see their chosen religion become better for them while simultaneously allowing those who wish to leave the opportunity to take a graceful bow and fade into the shadows. Thus concludes this portion of the pipe dream ;)
@GrandmaJones: You seem like a sweetheart. Your balanced viewpoints and love for your family are endearing. On what brought me here in the first place: False claims of Divine authority, faulty prophecies, fudged past teachings, flip-flopping doctrine, ignorance of science, comparative study of all the world's religions...that's a taste of what got me lurking and kept me lurking for so long. But I didn't want to jump all the way in as I still had feelings of loyalty to the Org. "What if I'm deluded? Am I being selfish? Am I being too critical? Is Satan really working on me through this site?" I just wasn't ready to join. I read the whole of JWFacts and CoC. Still lurking. But I haven't felt like a "proper" JW for quite some time now. What prompted me to finally join the forum was the education issue at KM School. I was like, "OK. This is just getting ridiculous." I needed to vent. I needed to be a part of the dialogue. I wanted to post my take on issues in hopes that other questioning JWs may see it and take a new course of action all their own.
@Cadellin: I have the same struggle in field service. My ministry has become personal visits, Bible-only discussions with very little literature placements, and broad discussions on all-encompassing spiritual/moral themes. This is certainly not what the Society has in mind for its publishers. I have no intention of indoctrinating anyone with JW theology. In fact, part of my awakening came while conducting Bible Studies in the Bible Teach book. Feeding people with promises that I myself was unsure of became impossible for me. I felt like a hypocrite.
@BlackSheep: I don't blame myself, or anyone for that matter. I just know how my immediate departure would be percieved and how those close to me would feel. When it comes to devout JWs, there is just no other possible way of life and if I can keep family and friends from being distraught and hurt by my actions, I will. The time is not right...yet. I don't want to burn bridges with those whom I may be able to help.
@LongHairGal: I'm sure there are many lurkers out there. Just looking at the amount of page views that some of these posts get is evidence of that. This site is not very interesting for someone who knows very little about JWs. If you come here, you likely have some sort of tie to the Org.
Welcome HayDay! I know that feeling all too well.
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55
Greetings to All, No Longer Lurking
by Franklin Massey inclaustrophobic.
that's the simplest way for me to express how i feel in the wt org.
like many here, my eyes were slowly opened over the years as i did more earnest research, trying to reconcile some long standing spiritual quandaries.
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Franklin Massey
Thank you for the warm greetings.
@zeroday: Exactly. Once my eyes and mind were opened by my own doing, on my own time, there was no way I could dismiss everything I was seeing and learning.
@ onemore: I guess I do fall into the category of "conscious class." For me, its not about proving people wrong. In fact, it has been more beneficial for me to just help people work through their questions/issues and come to a realization on their own. If I can guide them in these tiny little awakenings, I will. They add up. I made the mistake of emphatically broadcasting some of my "revelations" in the beginning and it just scared people and turned them off. My method now is one of patience, restraint, and more patience.
@stuckinamovement: The new book (which I saw online before I saw one on real life!) was not as big of a deal to me as some have made it. I can obviously see the tightening up taking place but the changes weren't that earth-shattering. I have to remind myself that the powers-that-be know they need to be careful not to make too many changes, of too large a size, too fast, for fear that there will be a mutiny. That's not to say that some brothers haven't mentioned certain aspects of the book that caught their eye. When they mention them, I ask, "Why do you think they made that change? How do you feel about it personally?" and then let them talk openly.
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139
Some observations from the KM Elder School I wanted to share with you.
by miseryloveselders inmy school was a couple weeks back, and it was interesting to a degree.
to be honest with you, it reminded me of a police crime scene investigation with yellow tape.
what i mean is, in one respect it was business as usual.
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Franklin Massey
Thank you for the welcome messages.
As to what I heard that gave me that final push, it was the education issue. The language used at the school was very different from that which has appeared in printed page. I know that this is WT normalcy; but many of the seemingly unbelievable quotes mentioned earlier in this thread are true. Our speaker asked the group if they thought "they could find a way around the Governing Body's direction." Some of our most loyal elders, educated and uneducated, parents and childless, left the meeting confused and concerned on the issue. One brother said it sounded like the Society was backtracking on recent published info. Our Circuit Assembly also contained strong counsel to avoid higher education. The speaker cherry-picked, out of context quotes (outdated stats, articles from countries in other parts of the world that are not known for being progressive when it comes to education) to attempt to paint a negative picture of furthering ones education. I compared notes with friends from other parts of my country and they found the talk to be painfully (and awkwardly) slanted against education.
I have dozens of reasons for joining the forum but this was "the straw that broke the camels back," so to speak.
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55
Greetings to All, No Longer Lurking
by Franklin Massey inclaustrophobic.
that's the simplest way for me to express how i feel in the wt org.
like many here, my eyes were slowly opened over the years as i did more earnest research, trying to reconcile some long standing spiritual quandaries.
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Franklin Massey
Claustrophobic. That's the simplest way for me to express how I feel in the WT org. Like many here, my eyes were slowly opened over the years as I did more earnest research, trying to reconcile some long standing spiritual quandaries. In the beginning, I had no goals of proving the WT wrong. It happened naturally as I did what JWs are encouraged to do: test and see that these things are good. As my understanding of doctrinal issues and orgizational history became clearer, the less attached to the org I became. The less attached I became, the easier it was for me to question my long held beliefs. My journey has been equally enthralling and heartbreaking; but totally worth it. I don't know it all. I'm not angry. I'm just a human in search of truth. I'll go where real truth leads me.
I'm in the org deep and have no current manner of leaving, lest I cause a lot of damage to those I love the most in life. I'm dealing with the situation as positively as I can and have been able to use the Society's own tactics/materials (that JWs are supposed to use to convert non-believers) in an attempt to make others really consider what they think they know. I don't want to demolish anyone's belief system, especially if it provides them comfort and structure. Teachers of "truth" should be refreshing, uplifting, and invaluable; not dogmatic, oppressive, and unflinching. There are very few absolute truths in the realm of spirituality and metaphysics. Therefore, when I see that narrow-minded WT teachings are causing people to be confused, overwhelmed, burdened, unrefreshed, and unenlightened - I feel obligated to plant seeds that hopefully will take root somewhere down the line. So far, there have been small, incremental results.
I would love to see reform within the org; but I don't see it coming anytime soon. Rather the situation seems to be reverting to a more authoritarian/less Christ-like environment. I have been lurking here for almost two years. The recent KM school pushed me to finally become a forum member. There is strength in numbers. There is hope gained from hearing that you are not alone in your struggle. Many of the brothers and sisters have cautiously shared with me the same concerns that a lot of you voice on this forum every day. As you post, please remember that there are possibly thousands of curious, doubting, concerned friends who sneak onto to this website in search of something. Show them they are not alone. Show them they are not dependent on any man-made religious entity. Show them that love, goodness, and compassion exist an more places that they may have ever known. Don't scare them away. Give them a reason to return.
Here we go...
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139
Some observations from the KM Elder School I wanted to share with you.
by miseryloveselders inmy school was a couple weeks back, and it was interesting to a degree.
to be honest with you, it reminded me of a police crime scene investigation with yellow tape.
what i mean is, in one respect it was business as usual.
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Franklin Massey
Attending the KM school was the final push I needed to move from "long time lurker" to "official forum member." Greetings, everyone.